It
PK++1.3.1.64
============
ADD: Locked/closed PK++ netcode version so that only PK++ clients can play on PK++ servers, and visa versa*
ADD: No-CD version of the Painkiller.exe
*(If you wish to continue using PK++ on Original PK servers, before you update, rename \data\PKPlus.pak to \data\PKPlusOld.pak, and create a new shortcut called
As always, you can update your PK++ by running Steamfish (found in \data\Updater.exe). Given the ability for PK++ to change without the guidance of the CPL now, further changes can be implemented soon. Watch this space.
*(If you wish to continue using PK++ on Original PK servers…) how stupid is that? why did u do the update then? Now ppl can still play on vanilla servers with pk++ o0o0
They always could? 0_o That was the whole point before of not splitting an already tiny server-set. Re-read the post…
The change now is to stop vanilla clients (or any non PK++ clients) joining PK++ servers with the new version. There was suggestion on the DC forums there may be some conflicts here and this is the best course to take.
*IF* and only if people want to continue on vanilla servers with the old version of PK++, the notes in the brackets tell you how.
THATS it! Now nomore mixing of PK++ and PK.
THX Blowfish!
As always to late ;).
PeTjA 😉 I’m glad someone understands it 🙂
Scooby, last time work was done on PK++, CPL/DC had indicated 1.7 (and PKTV) would be out soon/in a week… unsurprisingly things were held-off given that this seemed to be the case with beta versions of PKTV floating around. Of course nothing happened, and the wait was wasted (something it seems we’d seen before).
Second to this, with the CPL attracting new players to the game to impose this restriction would have not only limited the number of servers available to newbies (unmodded), but also limited the number of servers available to players (modded).
Now that the CPL is out of the way we can do this neatly without damaging new-comers to the game (since there aren’t as many). Unfortunately the truth is that of all the promises made by the developer, only one was done adequately (linux server).. the rest we are still waiting for.. as it is PK++ stepped in and fixed some of the more essential problems, and I hope (via bots and the rest) improved the enjoyment of the game for most people.
It seems odd that the developer was oblivious to most of what went on, right up to their game being featured on MTV.
It’s funny that you should suggest ‘to late’ in regards to PK++, and I am not sure about the ‘As always’ when PK++ updates on some days, were hourly as issues arose.
That said, in regard to the developer’s support or lack of it; then better late than never 🙂
Has this change any benefits in game? (eg: making the game smoother than before?)
PeTjA suggested elsewhere that the mix of modded and unmodded clients could lead to some issues, although it is highly likely these are server issues rather than PK++ issues. The non-mixing of mods and clients was something which was held off in PK++ for a long time (even the PK++ netcode modifications were backwards-compatible – hence the client authing). This mod version gives admins now the option of making their servers exclusive to the mod or not.
Given everything else with PK, even though PCF are working on the Xbox version now, it is unlikely that we will see a 1.7, or that if we do it will address any of the main issues already fixed by PK++. Which of course is a shame.
Now that the CPL etc. is out of the way, and that there is unlikely to be a sudden influx of new players, it is safe to make PK++ exclusive – and hopefully address concerns which Petja had about the game in this form – on the DC forums he had indicated it as his main concern about PK++, and given the state of PK, it is easily addressed in this update.
If i wrote that, its because when i stopped using pk++ to play i noticed the game was MUCH more smooth…and im really not the only one who noticed it
Tbh it’s the first I’ve heard about it (after 10 months?) – and you have to consider how many people have tested and used PK++ by now, at all levels, how much feedback there’s been from both players and server admins… how many iterations of the mod there have been – how many high level players sensitive to small changes in gameplay and performance. It’s very easy to convince yourself of something anecdotally. It might just be that you’ve not configured it correctly and left on autorecord or similar. The performance of PK++ itself is tried and tested and well understood…
However Petja’s suggestion is unclear on whether he means a vanilla or PK++ server for the mod-mixing. I suspect that the issue is PK’s netcode where those without PK++ (typically newbies), haven’t configured their network settings (and rendering settings which in PK are heavily interlinked) and therefore cause lag on the server .. and not an issue relating to the mod itself (of course your reply relates to neither).
PK++ fixes numerous issues which are utterly important to PK being used at any level… if you want a minor example, test respawn times in vPK/NewPK on a dedicated server with people playing. You’ll discover such things that items don’t even respawn when they should such is the extent of how badly coded some aspects of PK are and how much PK++ fixes. Let alone the issues relating to game physics, telefrag bugs, team bugs, and the like. The list of PK++ fixes is fairly substantial.
There’s no downside to this move, and if anything it encourages the remaining server admins to upgrade, or at very least provides a placebo fix for the doubters.
Well i was talking of online games of course 🙂
I would like the NewPK gameplay changes to be in pk++ (my first idea was that, you remember?) but you just ignored me all the time and now you write “newpk changes can be implemented” (i read it 😉 …….. if you really want to do that let me know soon otherwise i think i will release newpk 0.3 later today (sry if it sounds like an ultimatum lol)
People come together. Shake hands.
I like the PK++ Update because its closed now by default and i like NewPK too.
(I was thinking about contacting PunkBuster, because i thought there will be nomeore PK++ Update.)
I have kicked many players with PK++ from PK servers.
Someone is using pure PK on a PK++ server? I would kick him too!!!! Remember his mixing worked in both directions.
Smoother or not smoother?
I would say PK++ is a little smoother, but maybe im wrong. Im still not a big fan of the rocketfix itself, because i fail to much at GA jumps in DM_Fallen2. Also i think that some maps not designed for the changed physic.
But now the PK++ MOD is a closed MOD, im happy as a king and and for me its like christmas in januar.
I was also talking about online games..
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[01:10:10:30] <CuBe-eS|Crazy> its october Blowfish
[01:10:10:30] <CuBe-eS|Crazy> i wait your reply x]]]]]]]]
[01:10:10:31] <CuBe-eS|Crazy> i lost time to werite u and u will lose time to reply me kthx
When you wrote to me, PK++ was still under use by the CPL, and therefore could undergo no further changes*. Secondly what you were suggesting had already been done and the request of the community verbatim and simply not used by the community (‘ProPlus’). Your suggestions were not unique, and funnily enough given the range of gamers who’d come across PK++, I already had a wealth of suggestions of what *could* be done. PK++ at that time was mature in a state where the introduction of new ideas at one persons request were meaningless. Remember ProPlus was at the request of a large number of players and still failed to be popular… I suspect most of the interest in NewPK is largely novelty, and it is a shame that ProPlus wasn’t used when the same intent was there…
*For various reasons; 1. the CPL has a 30 day change policy which would have confused which version was being used. 2. Introducing a new version in whatever form would have risked a very stable and proven version at a late stage – there simply wouldn’t have been time to test regardless of whether the changes were unrelated to the mod in CPL form or not. 3. I simply did not have time.
By November you were asking for source code:
[10:11:14:31] <CuBe-eS|Crazy> if you can give me the pkplus.pak with uncripted .lua files (for my PERSONALuse )
There are a huge number of reasons why this would not happen. Giving the code to someone else involves MORE work for me, not less; I’d have to explain why things were done a certain way, and how things could be broken.. Aside from the fact the code contains, amongst other things, an aimbot and a host of features which would make cheating easy – I have and have always had a responsibility not to hand that out even for a terminally ill community. Thirdly there is the issue of intellectual property – to simply give away something which you’ve put a lot of time and effort into hugely devalues the work, in whatever form it ends up. Regardless, PK++ was a fun hobby for me, and I simply don’t have to justify my reasons for not wanting to give it out freely, for someone on a whim.
Feel free to release a 0.3 by all means.. I hope you have as much fun in your mod as I did with mine as a hobby. I’m not interested in ‘ultimatums’, if I can fix residual things for the community I will – but understand there is a world of difference between what the community wants, and a single person’s vision of what he wants to do. PK++ has ALWAYS been about what the community wants, and NOT about a single vision, and I will not compromise that even at this stage.
‘I would say PK++ is a little smoother, but maybe im wrong. Im still not a big fan of the rocketfix itself, because i fail to much at GA jumps in DM_Fallen2. Also i think that some maps not designed for the changed physic.’
We had this discussion a lot at the point of rocketfix.
Firstly the settings for rocketfix were decided by a vast number of people independently.. it was a huge project to fix PK based off of some very insightful views broadcast first on TsN and secondly discussed in the forums. I’m proud of what we managed to achieve with it given the founded concern at the point of change.
What had happened, is that with the removal of Havok for 1.4/1.5 onwards, the approximation of PK’s new movement didn’t match the old. You can read about this in more detail in the pdf in the PK++ documentation. The 1.62+ default rocket physics IS easier, and the reason for this is simple. The testing of the settings for the new physics engine were done by one person, who mistook the ease of rocket jumping for the desired feel (i.e. he made it into easy-lazy RJ’s). Rocketfix makes the jumps harder again, meaning there is more skill required. For saying the maps weren’t designed with rocketfix, then it is also true that NONE of them were designed for PK without the rocketfix – they were designed for 1.35 or less.
Rocketfix gives a very good approximation of 1.35’s physics and skill, or as close as it could be made without reverting entirely back. It SHOULD be hard to make the rocketjumps, since it is a way of showing off your skill. You may not like it that way, but the alternative destroys the game – I’d point you to the discussions about this, but the CPL forums are no longer with us (RIP).
‘I would say PK++ is a little smoother’
From what I’ve heard most would agree with that. Certainly there are numerous settings for increasing FPS and the fluidity of the game.
Yes when i wrote you that mail it was still CPL time, but from what you replied me it seemed like you didnt want to update pk++ even after the cpl was finished. (and thats why i asked you for the source code later)
About the resons for not giving me the source code: i perfectly understand your resons and i agree with you !!!
The problem is that you didnt write me these resons in irc, thats all what you wrote:
(15:38:32) (Blowfish) because I don’t want to give the source code out
(15:38:46) (Blowfish) it’s too fiddley to use and was never designed to be open source
then you started to ignore me for ages.
About NewPK: the features are NOT the same as the proplus ones and you can be sure that what i put in the mod is not just what i want my own: im in contact with all the remaining pk players around there and they almost all agree with what i did. And when there is something that someone dont like im always ready to change it if needed.
‘Yes when i wrote you that mail it was still CPL time, but from what you replied me it seemed like you didnt want to update pk++ even after the cpl was finished. (and thats why i asked you for the source code later)’
In your previous post you said I was ignoring you, now you are suggesting I said I would never update PK++ again – I don’t recall doing either.
‘The problem is that you didnt write me these resons in irc, thats all what you wrote’
Why do I have to justify my reasons for not giving you something I spent months working on? The reason I gave was more than adequate and does not justify your continued harassment – it doesn’t exactly inspire me to want to help you.
Your description of NewPK is interesting, but there’s still a fundamental difference in ideals and method – I hope you see that. ProPlus for example was purely driven by community discussion without ANY input from myself. It grouped all the major concerns (a lot tweaked by NewPK in exactly the same way) into one mode for people to play; so as to preserve the defaults and essentially give two mods for the price of one. Even so it was an option above the core improvements… I guess it is easy to get change and progress confused, as Mr. Arbiter points out. If I’d brought out ProPlus now instead of, hmm, 10 months ago I am sure it would be greeted with the same novelistic glee as greets NewPK. I wonder how many of the remaining PK’ers helped discuss the ideas of ProPlus or play-tested it. Yes there is a possibility to add the changes, but let’s take a look in detail…
Most of your gameplay changes relate to changes to the ElectroDriver weapon and some to the new weapons and Freezer.. hence on typical maps like sacred, psycho etc. your changes wouldn’t even be included. Even so, ED is hardly a dominating weapon even at high level, and the fact that freezer didn’t work properly until 1.64 without anyone noticing shows how important that is. Your most significant change is probably changes to telefrags and bronze armour, both of which are already part of ProPlus… Other than that it is unclear where the ‘beef’ is? Don’t get me wrong; I am all for gameplay tweaks where they can be justified, but these were not the driving issues in what needed fixing in PK… What I’d liked to have fixed is the netcode (and similar), but sadly this is locked away in the core (presumably forever) … that REALLY would have made a difference.
What PK needed was 1.7, and unfortunately it needed it a good 12 months ago (if not longer). What Angel said in his interview is correct though:
I guess that sums it up.
“In your previous post you said I was ignoring you, now you are suggesting I said I would never update PK++ again – I don’t recall doing either.”
But you replied to my mail (after many weeks) and i think you let me understand there you didnt want to update pk++ anymore but im not really sure cause it was months ago..btw that doesnt matter much anymore.
There isnt a real community so who should have driven newpk ? The purpose of the mod was in fact to attract more players so they can then drive newpk in future releases 🙂
Do you think the only gameplay changes are telefrags/bronze/ed ? Now i write a list of all them:
-New Stakegun damage system (in pk++ its just 150) [that for example is not an idea of mine; a german player suggested me to do so and lot of other players liked that “Warsow style”]
-Telefrags removed
-Weapons balance changes
-“New” version of PK maps
-Jumpad bug fixed (thats a lot important)
-Increased Bronze armor’s protection from 33% to 40% (in pk++ its 50%)
And also these features (wich are really minor…but still make the gameplay better):
-Binded “vote yes” and “vote no” commands to F1 and F2 (lol?)
-Increased hitsounds/killsound quality
-Projectiles (grenades,rockets, etc) fired during countdown will not longer “survive” after match started (thats in 0.3)
Here is my reply to your email, dated 01/10/2005
I don’t see anything suggesting I wouldn’t update PK++? Subsequent to that you started asking for source code, persistantly.
‘Do you think the only gameplay changes are telefrags/bronze/ed ?’
I said your ‘most significant’.
‘Increased Bronze armor’s protection from 33% to 40% (in pk++ its 50%)’
50% was the overwhelming request from a great many players from experience and from testing, which justified the figure. I assume 40% is justified in a similar way.
Ok i was wrong about you not wanting to make new pk++ versions at that time.
I find the jumppad bug fix as significant as the bronze armor protection increase (if not more) and i dont think thats only my opinion.
I would like to ask all these players why the difference between gold and silver armor should be 20%, but the difference between silver and bronze should be just 10%.
You were not only wrong, you also posted on my own site suggesting I didn’t have any reasons not for giving you the code – thereby implying a lack of support. That was unwise.
Justification for the values in armours were to be found on the CPL forums, which sadly are no longer there. I would imagine justification is partly based on other gaming experiences.
lol :ddd
i think creating and publishing PK-TV could ressurect the pk scene, coz now it’s quite inactive :]
PKTV was needed when there were big competitions around there (cpl ?)
What would you do with it now? O___o
PKTV, code-wise, represented fixing the demo code and looking at a lot of the netcode issues as part of that optimisation. Sadly neither were done and the alpha which did float around on the DC QA FTP for a while was a minimalistic approach to contractual obligations.
without PK-TV even small competitions are not attractive to spectators and video stream sux at all ;] could you imagine q3 wihout gtv?
‘without PK-TV even small competitions are not attractive to spectators and video stream sux at all ;]’
For most of the CPL WT, I thought the stream from TsN was excellent. I would guess some countries/ISP’s did not have a decent link, but with 60secs of buffering, for me at least, every stop was rock solid.
The lack of PKTV might have actually forced better coverage of PK than if it had been available – TsN suddenly became very important for the CPL. GTV, for example, as nice as it is to see the game in its natural form, there have always been problems of synchronising the feed to shoutcasts. Secondly it makes viewing the game inaccessible to those without PK. I saw lots of comments from people who obviously didn’t have PK appreciating the coverage. Bringing MP gaming (and hopefully more developer support for MP games) to the mainstream, naturally involves conveying the game in appropriate medium – PKTV wouldn’t have done that – what it would have done I covered before.
“Locked/closed PK++ netcode version so that only PK++ clients can play on”
WTF is this??!! It’s the most stupid idea I have ever seen! You killed PK for me by this change, couse with pk ++ installed I have 20 fps less:/ (it gives about 40 fps). n1 :/
Firstly you don’t have to use PK++ if you don’t want to. It is up to the server admins whether they wish to upgrade.
Secondly most people get higher fps with PK++ due to the various fps enhancements. If you have a problem with any feature though, most of them can be disabled. I suggest you look at the readme and work through the configurations.
I tryed disable everything blowfish, it runs worst then vanilla PK
pk++ not worst,pk++ can be improved performance,notic the settings in config.ini and readme
Thsi is piece of schit!
I have updated my PK via steamfish, and now i CAN NOT JOIN ANY server with PK++!!!
Not only vanilla, but ANY!!!
This new PK update was a fuckin mistake!
Where is the uninsatller!
You even have not included uninstaller!
Nowi have to uninstall all Painkiller!
I’d like to say **** YOU, but i hope someone will explain WTF is wrong!
Now i see that i can only access new PK++ servers, but how long will it take that all old PK++ will be changed to new PK++?
someone know where i can download pk 1.64nv2?
Imo here should be made server side mod which could improve netcode (pk netcode sux), something like unlagged technology in quake 3 (instaunlagged, ufreeze mods), unlagged is a lag correction system which make game absolutely playable even with very high ping (like 160), if this kind of a mod would be done then pk wouldnt died so quickly.
Please someone can tell me why I can’t play online? everytime appear a NET-error 1.64nv2 🙁 I have the original game (black edition and all patches and pk++ 1.0.1.64).
In pkeuro doesn’t exist nothing with this name 🙁
Run Steamfish (update to 1.3.1.64)
Keep in mind that U cant join previous servers then, so backup U files and read the 1.3.1.64 post
So many thanks PeTjA, I will try to do this 😀
ok, now I can play on vanilla servers but the question is: why can’t play online whit PK++mod?
pk++mod is wonderful anyway 🙂
I apologize PeTjA, I didn’t read carefully the post :p
@ blowfish: thanks, I can play (finally) on vanilla servers with PK++1.2.1.64 and this is great but I would like to play online with PK++ mod and his features (other commands line, new GUI, bots … etc)
I suppose the way is to delete PKPlus.pak and to install the old PK++1.0.1.64. Then rename PKPlus.pak in PKPlusOld.pak and create a shortcut. Now update PK++ with Steamfish.
Is it right? 🙂
Hi, everyone! I’m new here… and i want to ask you for a little help.. 😉 how can i download pk 1.64?
PK 1.64 need 3 patches:
– 1.61 (330MB)
– 1.62 (90MB)
– 1.64 (10MB)
… just downloading 1.64 dont work.